- Posted by marie on July 20th, 2009 filed in That's Fashion
SO. A blogger recently featured me in a sort of style roundup on her blog, which was really nice and all…until I did a double neck-jerk at the heading titled “Fat Love Friday” UM…I don’t TINK so! Da hell? Peep this.
So I replied.
Hey - Thanks for the comment and sweet write up on your blog…but I have to be honest, I’m a bit offended that you’re categorizing me in something called Fat Love Friday, SON!!!!!!
You know I obviously ain’t no size 4. And I don’t put down anyone who is. I fucking love my body and I admire and respect all the other curvy confident women out there, but I would NEVER put another blogger or really anyone else for that matter underneath a title with such a negative connotation unless they identify themselves as that already. Ain’t nobody allowed to call me fat homie!! Are you crazy!?!? I don’t want to sound like an unappreciative dick but I have never once called myself a plus-size, pro-whatever fat fashionista. I don’t give a fuck about that shit. To me putting labels on things just segregates everything more. Style is style girl. Why does it have to be labeled as skinny or fat or whatever you know?
Again, I don’t want to sound all bitch status but I hope you understand where I’m coming from.
All the best,
-Marie
Obviously I am no skinny Minnie but proper etiquette is to ask permission to be featured in something…ESP with a title like that! Ain’t nobody about to call me fat except for my momma (Filipino moms hello).
People who are truly confident about themselves don’t have to put that fact on blast. It’s an obvious thing.
The girl did write me and apologized and and I don’t think she meant any harm, but is a bit oblivious to the fact that a lot of people won’t see things her way. No matter how many times anyone tries to empower the word, the word fat ain’t going to be thought of as positive unless it’s spelled with a PH, ok?
I also told her:
Fat is, no pun intended, a heavy word, girl!
Like I said, I am not the type of person who gives a shit how people see me as. Plus-size, voluptuous whatever. Big booty girls DO make the world go ’round, but I honestly believe if you are truly confident in yourself you don’t have to talk about it and keep focusing attention on all that shit. I don’t need to wear a sign around my neck and label myself as plus-size just so OTHER people are aware that I’m proud of my body. I just work my shit. And would continue to do so if I became a size 4. Ya dig?
If you follow me on Twitter you might have already caught wind of the sitch, but for everyone else, what are your thoughts?
AH YES FINAL NOTE: On the real tip, I’m too small to be plus-size and too chub to be petite. I’m just floating somewhere in the middle flipping everyone off. JK
July 20th, 2009 at 11:02 pm
girlll i lover u.
July 20th, 2009 at 11:14 pm
Aw, way to villianize me
In my defense, I also offered to remove the article, but Marie wanted it left up. The offer still stands…
Hopefully people will be smart enough to realize I meant it in a positive way and the whole thing was praise and admiration. And yes, I did apologize for not asking in advance. Hopefully the offer to remove it remedied that?
My view is that the word “fat” doesn’t always have to be used negatively. And I certainly didn’t use it that way in the post.
It seems to me you are being a bit sensitive, and if you are as okay with your body as you say you are, why be so defensive?
To be clear: I make that feature to highlight beautiful ladies with amazing style to prove that you don’t have to be a size 2 to be stylish. There is usually nothing but positive feedback (not to mention the wonderful feedback yours received) left on these kinds of posts, and a few of my readers have told me how much they particularly enjoy them. What’s wrong with wanting to do that? Or should I just not use the term “fat”? Even though curvy, voluptuous, chubby, plus-sized, and any number of the more decorative terms all mean the same thing?
I also understand you said that you wanted to post this to spark debate and conversation, which is fine, but like I said, feeling a little villianized…
July 20th, 2009 at 11:33 pm
@Mars- Oh jesus. You’re not being villainized. I’m keeping it real with you dude. Try to change the meaning of the word all you want. Fat is fat. No woman, no girl, no matter what age is going to want to be called that. And that’s the gawtdamn dirty truth. I’m over arguing about this shit. You got your opinion, I got mine. Hope this helps you though.
July 20th, 2009 at 11:44 pm
If you don’t identify as chubby, why do you want the article left up :/? It was a simple mistake on my part and I did my best to fix it. You know the only comments you’ll get here are automatic “you’re not fat what a horrible person!!” type things. If you need some of that (hey, we all have those days) that’s cool but I never volunteered to be “that bitch who called you fat.”
July 21st, 2009 at 12:02 am
What Universe are you from that you think someone who objects to being labeled as FAT is being sensitive. NO ONE wants to be labeled fat… not even Phat. Even the Spanish term of endearment wears off above the age of 7. Why don’t you just say “Style Mavens I love” or something and not label people fat. You’re making yourself sound like a creepy fetishist.
Related:
http://www.laurengreenfield.com/index.php?p=y6qzz990
July 21st, 2009 at 12:04 am
I don’t think that Marie put this up here at all to get people to be ‘oh maaa gawwd you’re not fat!’ but to just say that the word ‘fat’ just doesn’t have any positivity in it TO ANYONE. The term ‘fat’ is what has been giving people (from sizez 0 to +++) eating disorders and bad self esteem from the year dot.
I think it’s of course clear that you weren’t intending on causing any harm and of course your blog is super sweet to all featured, but what the silly thing is to be commending ‘fat’ girls on their style like it’s only skinny girls who have style in the first place? Really the article should just be like a stylish Friday where you are admiring like you do, and maybe some girls are skinnier and some are bigger than others but who cares?
xo
July 21st, 2009 at 12:06 am
I should also add that it’s really saddening that the term ‘thin’ has become known as just a regular compliment.
July 21st, 2009 at 12:20 am
Oh man..this Mars is the reason blogging needs muzzle management. May I please just say:
1. Nobody messes with Lady Miss ‘Rie for she is the reigning queen of love and ahte and all in between! Ya’ heard?! Read that again, then read it one more time. Then realize that if you mess with ‘Rie, then you are, truly, nobody.
2. Lady Miss ‘Rie has ALWAYS presented herself exactly how she views herself which is exactly how she just described herself! A) She ain’t fat. B) Used in the sentence, “This person is fat,” the word “fat” defines itself as a derogatory word. Either stand behind your curdling ejaculation of bile-embroidered verbosity and complete your fecal-brushed self-portrait of belligerence, or admit it was wrong to use said term then shut it! If you have to sell people on your definitions, then your definitions are clearly being paired to a language no one speaks.
3. Mars, give it a rest. Homegirl straight to’ you how she feels about your post. Don’t go telling people to feel other than they do. Please leave the building.
July 21st, 2009 at 12:33 am
Loulou: Thanks for the kind and thoughtful response. I agree it’s sad about thin being a compliment…You’ve also touched on the point that I’ve been trying to make: I’m trying to make plus size fashion accessible. It’s been pretty ignored as far as I can tell, as far as the media goes.
In regards to fat not being positive, I don’t think that’s necessarily true…There is an entire pro-fat movement dedicated to changing this.
If that’s what you are (and I am), why not own up to it with pride? I always found it silly and embarrassing when someone told me I wasn’t.
I will feature thinner people who inspire me, but I am chubby myself…so I relate most to those like me. I don’t see what’s wrong with that?
And say I changed the title, no mention of the word fat. What am I supposed to call it? Curvy, plump, plus-size…like I said, it all means the same thing.
So far, Marie is the only person who has had a problem with it (asked or not asked) and she is the same size as the other ladies.
I understand body image is a delicate issue and I’m in no position to tell her how she should label herself, but I don’t think the weekly thingamajigger is really such a big deal…
Vidalia: The fetishist comment must have entertained you, but that’s really quite a stretch.
July 21st, 2009 at 12:50 am
Anyway, sorry it didn’t work out Marie. Please let me know if you change your mind about wanting it taken down.
July 21st, 2009 at 1:50 am
You go, girl! We’ve all been categorized in a hurtful way at one time or another and you did the right thing by taking a stand against something that you didn’t agree with.
July 21st, 2009 at 2:20 am
I can see both sides here - I made an embarassing mistake on my own blog once labelling a Muslim blogger under alternative fashion. She was cool about it but didn’t really like being singled out as different.
There are a lot of bloggers on my blogroll and who I’ve linked to who use the word fat as a simple describer and are trying to reclaim it from its nasty usage. So if you read enough fat-acceptance blogs you could easily forget that it’s still used in a really offensive way out of that new political context.
We’re all on the continuum of weight somewhere so I think the problem is also bunching people together on an arbitrary basis. All good style is just good style and no one needs positive discrimination to be decreed stylish.
Love your blog by the way Marie, sorry for the first comment being on something not so pleasant!
July 21st, 2009 at 4:42 am
“If you have to sell people on your definitions, then your definitions are clearly being paired to a language no one speaks” - that is a great sentence, Friendinator!
Ms Marie, I am so glad you brought this up. I noticed on your site you never really brought up the topic of weight, only saying here and there that you needed a diet. But, yet, I could not help but notice that you ARE curvy and beautiful and that makes your outfits even more inspiring - to be blunt, you look fucking hot on da regular. I agree that ones weight should not necessarily play into their personal politics - I’m heavy but I ain’t yellin’ it around town b/c I don’t see the big diff btwn me and my super skinny friends! Sorry, Mars, I know you feel victimized but you can’t assume a word is ok for everyone (even if you find it ok for yourself), especially one that reverberates so strongly for all women (in the US at least).
Sorry for the long post, topic muy importante.
July 21st, 2009 at 5:49 am
I’m with you, floating around somewhere in the middle. To big to be little, too little to be big.
Curvy and voluptuous is what I like to go with. So everyone else better go with that too!
July 21st, 2009 at 6:07 am
Marie, you know that I’m a true plus-sized gal, and I’ve never really not been. At my thinnest, I was a 10/Gap;12-14/Express, and I loved my kickin’ bod.
Being called Fat, even when someone is trying to make it positive, just isn’t cool. Even if the intent is to make plus-sized fashionable, there are ways to do it that aren’t inclusive or exclusive, by just highlighting that style DOES come in all sizes. I agree when others suggest Mars call her series just something like “Style Mavens I <3″
& for you Marie, from someone who would love your curves:
‘Cause your waist is small and your curves are kickin’
And I’m thinkin’ bout stickin’
To the beanpole dames in the magazines:
You ain’t it, Miss Thing!
Give me a sister, I can’t resist her
Red beans and rice didn’t miss her
July 21st, 2009 at 6:11 am
Well, if you don’t want to called fat that is your right and while i don’t think the article was meant in a malicious way, it’s still your prerogative, like Bobby Brown, to say don’t put me under that label. My mom always says “It’s not what you’re called, it’s what you answer to.”
She meant full (pun intended) well, but missed the mark by a lot (again pun intended)
July 21st, 2009 at 8:06 am
oh mars, common sense shoulda told you not to do what you did OR to at least tell the chicks you’re writing about what exactly you want to TITLE the piece. of course you’re gunna need to run that by your subject. should you not, that’s just RUDE plain aaaaaand simple. can’t really argue with that, man….
July 21st, 2009 at 9:05 am
Dang, the drama’s like junior high in here lol… I have to say, I really truly don’t believe the blogger mean her post maliciously, though perhaps she didn’t think it through entirely. And props for sticking up for yourself in a ladylike way Marie! Down with silly ‘inspirational’ categories! Hell, if you’re fat you know it. If you’re hot you know it and if you have great style you know it.
July 21st, 2009 at 10:27 am
I love your blog and I was on here to check out some more sweet-ass Japan shopping porn, but then stumbled on this conversation.
I myself would totally be categorized as plus sized. Checking out the “fat fashion” blogs, and “fat acceptance” sites, I started thinking about how they’re trying to reclaim the word fat. It is very reminiscent of the gay community trying to reclaim the word “fag.”
I get where Mars is coming from and I do feel sorry for her since you can tell she only had good intentions and made a mistake. But I also understand that when you’re reclaiming a word that has really negative connotation to a lot of people’s self esteem, it’s a little like playing with fire. Somebody’s feelings gonna get burned.
For me personally, I totally agree with Marie on the fact that labels just segregate people more! Lets just all be fucking people.
My bottom line is: Fat is something you have, not something you are, no matter what size clothes you wear. Ya dig?
July 21st, 2009 at 11:15 am
I think your message to her was well-written, Marie. I wouldn’t want to be a poster-child for something I didn’t proclaim. I’m totally with you on how labels segregate.
July 21st, 2009 at 12:43 pm
Girl, I have this theory and YOU know it, but I’m gonna post it here because I think everyone in the whole world needs to see my smelly ol’ opinions.
I got this rep on certain areas of the internet for being anti-fatty and I stand by it. The way I define “fat” is not a dress size, or how much ass you fit inside them jeans, it’s an attitude, a mind set, a personality.
Fat girls are the ones continuously trying to remind you that real women have curves and sulking in a corner when they are reminded that Marilyn’s size 14 was not THEIR size 14. You know, the gals who make FAT LOVE blog posts about other girls who have a healthy self-esteem.
Badass broads don’t bother with negative body nomenclatures, because anyone who is anyone would never identify them with the CHUBS and FATTY words in the first place.
I’ll be inside a shabby chic coffin before I would call any of the ladies I love and respect any word that isn’t “fly” “legit” “badass” etc. And while it may sometimes slip that I’m jealous of a someone’s bodacious figure, I’ll be damned if I call them something best left to the girls that have NOTHING ELSE to offer other than their big bodied pride.
A size 2 girl can be a big old fatty in my mind, the moment they start going out of their way to bring attention to their body size, in any way that could be insulting to someone else. I mean, what if I did a “potato-shaped woman love” or “diminished glutes girls” blog. That shit just wouldn’t be ok, despite the fact I’ve accepted the fact I’ve got a mad shapeless torso and flat ass.
Be comfortable with your body and you won’t need “FAT PRIDE”.
/end senseless rambling
July 21st, 2009 at 2:53 pm
you know what, i read this through feedburner in my inbox, and all i was doing was coming in here to say “woohoo marie!” especially after we talked about this on twitter yesterday.
then i clicked on “comment” and read that whatshername’s reply.
i think i am a nice person, ok, i just have to tell it like it is sometimes. i would never say something that isn’t true, ESPECIALLY over the internet.
well DAMMIT. “awww, way to villianize me, smily face?”
VILLIANIZE? don’t use poison words like that with a fucking smiley face and think it makes it alright. it’s like people saying something mean and saying “no offence”.
like if i told some girl on the street, “hey girl! i love your style, but you’re fat, oh, no offece.”
BUT OOPS, YOU DID THAT DIDN’T YOU?!?!
sure sure sure, you didn’t mean for the post to turn out that way. i get it, i really get it.
i’m no skinny bean pole myself, and there have been times when i’ve asked myself what the hell have i eaten since i moved to america, that i put on all this weight? i don’t care enough to diet, but that doesn’t mean i don’t care about how i look or how people see me.
like someone else said, if you wanted to feature FAT girls with style, it should have just been called a different word. and in fact, if you thought that skinny girls didn’t have to be the only ones who looked good, why are you putting the non-size-2s in a group?? why can’t you feature girls of all sizes, no matter what they weigh and what size they wear, as long as they look good and feel confident in their own skins?
i don’t care where one is from; i’ve lived in singapore, tokyo, and new york, and have traveled and collected enough stamps in my passport to tell you that the word fat, in english, mandarin, cantonese, japanese, and even french, is never nice. it means what it means. it’s like if you called someone ugly.
what the hell? who gave you the right to?
“It seems to me you are being a bit sensitive”. if someone said that to my face, especially someone whom i have never met, i would probably want to start a fight.
i think i’m so pissed off because it doesn’t matter what marie said, or what anyone else here said. you, mars, came in to this so defensive and saying things like, “well i offered to take it down and she said it was ok to leave it up, so don’t come blaming me now.” that’s what you meant and you know it.
i don’t care that you’ve emailed marie to apologize. to me, obviously that apology was insincere and unfelt, because you obviously still don’t see what you did was wrong!
don’t think that i’m here defending marie because we are best buds. i’ve only met marie once ever and only know her through her strong and beautiful pictures. yes i do adore her and admire her style. but even if this had happened to someone else, what’s wrong is wrong, and i’m not one of those people to watch something happen in front of me and walk away just because i don’t want to get involved. if we all did that, this world is done for, and the person who walks away from it is just as bad as the person who did it. my parents taught me to speak up for what is right.
July 21st, 2009 at 3:19 pm
Who gets to decide the definition of ‘fat’?
In my opinion Marie is not fat, she is womanly and she looks great. Marie, top reply, you’ve handled yourself well here. The blogger clearly still doesn’t understand where she has gone wrong, because she had good intentions she can’t seem to see how she could have caused offence and because you’ve told her not to bother with removing her post she can’t understand that you could *still* be offended by the content, but you’ve tried to be as clear as you could - it’s certainly not on you that the message just isn’t seeping in.
& just for the record, Gilda, sweetheart, you are gorgeous.
July 21st, 2009 at 6:47 pm
o HELL YES TIFFANY! Sweet truth. also, hell yes to Gilda as well. You gals read my mind.
July 21st, 2009 at 6:48 pm
I commented on the original post on Mars’ blog and I totally agree with the fact that Marie should have been asked permission first so that she could know that it was called “Fat Love Friday.” If people are fashionable and have great personal style then their weight or size should not matter.
And better put by Beth: “ones weight should not necessarily play into their personal politics - I’m heavy but I ain’t yellin’ it around town b/c I don’t see the big diff btwn me and my super skinny friends!” So true! If others think I have great style, then awesome - it shouldn’t matter that I’m a bigger girl. I think this is something that I’ve had to deal with on my own. Yeah, I’m a bigger girl, but no one is allowed to call me fat unless I label that myself. No matter what, the word fat is always going to have a negative connotation.
July 21st, 2009 at 9:31 pm
i agree that it is proper netiquette to approach someone for this sort of feature. you shouldn’t be featured anywhere in any context that you aren’t comfortable with. that’s totally your perogative, you know?
i don’t agree with the comments that no one could possibly be ok with the word fat. i’m fat and, if you’ll allow me to trumpet a bit, stylish and it’s VERY important for me to identify as both. the personal is political and just being “out” with and ok with the word fat has improved my life and the life of other people. i get comments and emails from people that seeing my openly fat ass on flickr gives them permission to pursue style and to look in the mirror and feel a little less hate. the reality is that we live in a world with a very narrow beauty standard and while we might not all have the same politics, it does have political meaning and broader (har) significance to identify as the very thing the beauty industry tells us it is so horrible to be. i am fat, i still like how i look, i still have style, i don’t break chairs every day and my life isn’t awful. you know?
July 22nd, 2009 at 9:18 am
Marie,
I understand where you are coming from as far as size. I used to be thinner when I was an athlete now I am bigger. Same boat..I am not plus but I am not skinny either. I am sumwhere in the middle. Being 5ft any weight makes me bigger than a tall chick n i got my brown curves and hips (that i loves). I like being curvier but ya i get really frustrated feeling like i cant wear shit i could wear before. But then i c the cool shit u wear and i want to dress like how i did when i was younger n i didn’t give a shit. I look at ur cute shit and am trying to make an effort to say fuck it i am going dress how i want and fuck everyone else. I don’t have to look like i did before I just have to like what i am wearing. like ur cutes heart glasses..i am like i love those but then I am like can i rock those now? i could totally rock those when i was young..long rant haha just venting I guess..point being..but just wanted to let u know that u have kick ass style and i am inspired not by by ur size but ur style and attitude.
Much love,
Amanda
July 22nd, 2009 at 10:38 am
i think the idea of the blog is cool, a way to show people that you can look awesome no matter what size you are, but it would probably work better were the pics submitted by the gals themselves & then the best ones chosen by mars & posted. a lot of people don’t find fat to be a negative word, it’s just a descriptor after all - fat, skinny, tall, short, etc - but the fact remains that a lot of people DO & finding yourself as a plus-size style icon could be very hurtful to somone who has issues with their size, even if others think they look fantastic.
i am pleased with the way you handled the situation, marie, & hope that others can maybe learn a thing or two from you. in a society that’s constantly cramming the idea that there is only one way to look beautiful down everyone’s throats, we could all stand to be a bit more sensitive when it comes to words like fat, skinny, ugly & pretty. power to the ‘fatshionistas’ & all but just because you’re fat doesn’t mean you’re beautiful or stylish anymore than being skinny does. size really doesn’t matter.
July 22nd, 2009 at 12:42 pm
gracious & well said.
*high five*
July 22nd, 2009 at 1:41 pm
i am a “skinny” girl and i got yer back! some people kvetch about my natural weight, and it’s rude, because being wrongly labeled anorexic is hardly a compliment.
categorizing by weight is rude for the same reason we don’t give people racial nicknames.
i prefer to be recognized for my AWESOMENESS than some superficial category i didn’t choose myself.
style is style, and you’ve GOT IT.
stay beautiful.
kenna
July 22nd, 2009 at 3:33 pm
you know… only my momma is allowed to call me fat.
July 22nd, 2009 at 10:22 pm
[...] • At some point, we’ve all been associated with a term that we find hurtful and when fellow blogger Marie of Agent Lover didn’t like how an article categorized her, she was brave enough to take a stand. [...]
July 23rd, 2009 at 12:46 am
I agree that fat is a term that ought to be self-identified, but the way you’ve responded to this blogger is really over the top. To bring it to your blog, where you know you will be directing your readers toward the original post with a BOGLOAD of bias is a shitty way to approach the situation. Two wrongs do not make a right.
Check out the fat-o-sphere, blow your mind. You might even come to accept that “fat” is not a pejorative.
July 23rd, 2009 at 12:47 am
I see Mars’ concern - the only person (aside from your commentors) that’s making it out to be an insult is you, and Mars was right when she said that posting this here will only result in a barrage of pro-Marie comments. Tends to happen with any sort of blog that has any sort of following - loyal commentors will hardly stop to consider that they may disagree with their favourite blogger.
Those of you who think no one could possibly want to be called fat has obviously not seen the Fat Pride/Health At Ever Size movement. One of my good friends, who can introduce herself here, is reclaiming the term “faT” to make it fashionable. There are also awesome tumblrs such as Fuck Yeah Fat Chicks and Fuck Yeah Death Fatties (which my friend maintains) which makes the term fun and happy.
There’s no need to project your insecurities over the term onto people who are trying to give you a compliment. I can understand it being tiring - I get fed up of people considering me “exotic” as though that’s the only thing I’m good for - but instead of going “OH HELL NO BITCH DON’T YOU DARE” just say “hey, thanks for the sentiment, but maybe some other choice of words.” Heck, some of us - like me, who’s more of an inbetweenie like you - find it distasteful when people try to continue the connontation of fat being negative, like saying “urgh I feel fat it’s horrible”, because it then insults people who actually are fat, whether they call themselves that or not. “Oh, so *I* am a negative adjective now?”
Instead of jumping around and assuming that everyone thinks the way you do, try stopping for a moment and consider the term at least. It would have made for a far better blog post, for one.
Mars I got ya back!
July 23rd, 2009 at 2:22 am
Hey Mars! You’ve already seen this in your inbox, but I thought I’d add it here too
I’ll admit I thought the “villainize” comment was ill-advised … you probably think that too now I guess! I don’t think that was what Marie was trying to do AT ALL, in fact she’s given you some great press there tbh — I know I’m a new subscriber to your blog because of it! However, I’ve also been the victim of a “look what this person SAID about me!” blogpost (I review other people’s books — ack), so I know that when you’re the one being written about in a public forum, it’s hard to stay objective and see the positives. I just want you to know that to an outsider, it just looked liked you and Marie were having an interesting — and not even particularly heated! — discussion, one that I think is very, very valuable and relevant, personally! It didn’t look like she was trying to appoint blame or villainize you at all.
I’m really, really interested in the concept of language and its connotative powers (I’m an MA/MSc/soon-to-be PhD in English… go figure!), and I think that the idea of re-claiming words and changing their meanings is a fascinating and actually very cerebral, academic approach. I also think it’s insanely difficult — professors the world over have written research paper after research paper on why words flag up the connotations that they do, and whether it’s possible to reverse or even stop this. There have been amazing experiments done where people have been asked to write a word repeatedly over and over and over — after a while of doing this, the word they write just becomes a shape, with no meaning. But the human brain is so hard-wired to acknowledge the connotations of that word that half an hour later, they’ll see the word exactly the same as they always did. It’s really amazing… but anyway, I’m geeking. The point is, I think you’re delving into very interesting territory by trying to reclaim “fat”, but sadly, other people generally can’t get onto that kind of level without their emotions getting in the way. YOU’VE reconciled yourself to the word, and for that I absolutely tip my hat to you — it’s something I could never do (and at 5′11″ and 165 lbs, it’s not like it’s a non-issue to me!). Other people? Harder to reconcile! I reckon if you want to keep on with this FAT DOES NOT = EVIL crusade, YOU GO FOR IT, but have the courage in your convictions to make YOURSELF the poster girl for that movement! That way other people don’t have to wear the label if they don’t want to, but if you show you’re not afraid to, they might just follow your badass lead.
Thanks for raising this issue — it’s a good ‘un.
<3 Claire, One Night Stanzas
July 23rd, 2009 at 3:28 am
You handled this situation SO well Marie, you’re a wonderful amazing & inspiring girl!
July 23rd, 2009 at 5:14 am
Mars offered to take down the article, and instead you turn it into a chance to whine and complain. If you were handling this appropriately, you would have requested she remove you from the post rather than bitch about it on here. Lame.
July 23rd, 2009 at 6:09 am
I almost commented on that little twit’s blog, but then I realized that she would be getting the credit, not you.
I just want to say that you shined in this situation - it’s not easy to hear things on the Internet and take them in stride, much less stand up for yourself so eloquently.
I’m just saddened and surprised by the ignorance and hate that seems to persist. It’s everywhere. I try to see the beauty in the world, and inevitably someone comes along with their “It’s just a word - like gay, jew, black, fat.” Labels are just evil. EVIL. Narrow-minded people make me sad.
Okay, off my soapbox. Thanks for being such a rocking chick. I came here via Nubbytwiglet, but I think you found a new subscriber (I already hit up your twitter feed
July 23rd, 2009 at 6:14 am
“I’m trying to make plus size fashion accessible. It’s been pretty ignored as far as I can tell, as far as the media goes.” -Mars
Oh MAN, I just saw this. LMAO! She is a real Mother Teresa, that one.
July 23rd, 2009 at 6:40 am
I totally understand Marie’s objection, but I do think Mars didn’t mean to do any harm and I was impressed by her comments here. She obviously should have asked permission before including someone in a feature like that! But if she offered to take it down, why not go with that? If you complain and someone offers to take an acceptable action to alleviate your concerns as a result … you’ve won the battle, no?
July 23rd, 2009 at 7:10 am
You know, I gotta say, no h8 to the blog itself or anything, but that “fuckyeahdeathfat” thing doesn’t help take a negative connotation off of the word Fat, okay?
The blog itself is good enough, in that it’s letting the really big girls have some of the spotlight too, which is great. But deathfat? Really? I don’t think obesity to the point of severe health risks should be celebrated. And I mean that with JUST the name of the blog, not the blog itself.
FuckYeahIAmSoObeseIHaveAHigherRiskOfDeathThanOtherPeople? Weird.
Anyway, that was OFF TOPIC, sorry.
July 23rd, 2009 at 7:11 am
Wow, the post was one thing (though I can see where you’re coming from) but your commentors are being unnecessarily vicious towards Mars (esp Briar above). She’s been nothing but civil towards you guys, no need to mock her further.
July 23rd, 2009 at 7:12 am
Celisse: The “Death Fattie” thing was a tongue-in-cheek term. It’s something of an injoke amongst the fat-o-sphere.
July 23rd, 2009 at 7:20 am
I did not read all the replies. I founf this through Sally’s (Of Already Pretty) Facebook post.
I would not enjoy being called fat, just sayin.
However, I am super glad that Sally posted about this if for NO other reason than I had never seen your site, and Girl, you are amazing and I am adding you to my blog roll right now. Work. I love your style.
July 23rd, 2009 at 7:41 am
everyone shut the fuck up and eat these cupcakes, they are delicious
July 23rd, 2009 at 8:01 am
EXSQUEEZE ME has any one noticed that most of the fashion choices on the other website look like caca dooty you find at a yard sale? just ’cause it’s second-hand DON’T MEAN IT’S VINTAGE, LAYDEEEEEZ. miss agent lover, you look like a freakin’ sparkling *diamond* in the rough over there… SORRY CHICKIES FROM THE OTHER BLOG don’t mean to step on any toes, but regular old hand-me-downs being labeled “vintage” happens too dang often and it’s just not alright. aspiring fashionistas, take note.
July 23rd, 2009 at 8:47 am
It will always be negative until people work to change the connotation. I have no problem being called fat unless I know someone is using the term to imply that I am also stupid/lazy/worthless/ugly/dirty/etc.
July 23rd, 2009 at 8:50 am
Oh, PS I am a 23 year old woman, so you might be wrong about this one:
“No woman, no girl, no matter what age is going to want to be called that. And that’s the gawtdamn dirty truth.”
July 23rd, 2009 at 9:15 am
check it out. i believe what marie is trying to get at is that she doesn’t want to be called fat and that’s her right. can’t ya’ll respect that?
and also i think that since she wasn’t asked first to be a part of the entry that she has every right to villianize it now.
let’s not put any type of sugar on it, some of us don’t like that name. it’s ALMOST like saying well if we keep saying N***** we’ll change it’s meaning. give me a fucking break.
July 23rd, 2009 at 9:38 am
I agree with WendyB… you have totally valid points and I’d hate being segregated by something I have no choice over in an article (even if the thing I was being segregated by wasn’t in and of itself negative, like being Asian), but Mars did offer to rectify the situation and she is keeping the article up out of respect for your wishes. Obviously, I don’t have access to your private e-mails, but could it be possible that what you see as her being “oblivious” to your POV is just Mars being as opinionated as you are yourself (and your sticking to your guns is to be commended, by the way)? In fact, this could be grounds for a really fruitful dialogue — and it has been, except for some of the more personal comments left on both posts targeting both you and Mars.
July 23rd, 2009 at 9:39 am
RIGHT ON, rain, RIGHT FUCKING ON *YESSSSS*.
July 23rd, 2009 at 10:14 am
Just here to LOL@fat-o-sphere. It brings to mind visuals I probably ought not share.
July 23rd, 2009 at 10:17 am
Being coined as “fat” is not ok, regardless of your size. Never.
Go you for not having it!
July 23rd, 2009 at 11:05 am
I was feeling a bit down about this whole thing and wasn’t sure I wanted to participate anymore, but now I’ve had time to really think on it :3! Not to mention I’m getting super awesome feedback (good and bad) out the wazoo! I’m going to do this up list style, ’cause well, I love me some lists xD:
1. I should have asked beforehand. I admitted this early on and it was a silly mistake on my part. I guess I WAS being a little oblivious, thinking it wouldn’t make anyone upset. Ah, hindsight is 20/20 though, ya know?
2. In my defense, I did offer to take it down. I’m honestly not sure why Marie wants it left up if it offends her. I’m leaving it up until she tells me to take it down because I *DO* admire her. I think it would have been a shame not to share her style, that’s why I chose her in the first place.
3. I don’t know how to be more clear: that feature is strictly for fat girls because I AM ONE :D. I relate to these girls. I want them to have a place in the fashion blogging community. I link to and occasionally discuss my thinner bloggy friends (who I equally adore!), but for the most part, I have seen them on other blogs - multiple times!
4. I think the bottom line here, plainly put, is that Marie does not identify as fat. Which is okay! I am NOT here to tell anyone how they should see themselves.
5. But I won’t apologize for trying to use the word fat in a positive light. I think it’s empowering to take back a word that has caused you pain in the past.
I really appreciate everyone’s input! I think it’s been pretty educational, don’tcha think :P? When faced with conflict, I’m not always the most articulate as I’d like to be, so I hope everyone read all the comments above me, they said everything so much better than I did :)!
July 23rd, 2009 at 11:18 am
PHEW LAWTY CHILE!!!!!
Where do I even begin here??
I never write about anything controversial on here. MY INTERNET MAXI PAD is the Pee Wee’s Playhouse for Fashion Bloggers where we talk constantly about ladyboners and wear corn suits. I have never once planned or thought to have such a crazy ass blog.
I’d love to reply to all of you but I never got that glass of wine. Please know that I appreciate everyone’s input on this topic, no matter whose “side” you are on. Everyone has very valid points and that is the sexiness of free speech!
SO LEMME BREAK IT DOWN TO YOU.
I never EVER wanted anyone to be attacked on my blog. This is a place of LOVE. I am truly sorry that Mars and I were both victims of attack on both her website and mine. To everyone who asked why I wanted her to leave the post up: Sure, the easy way to have dealt with this situation was to have had her remove the posting, but my instincts said “bitch ple this is something you want to talk about!” So I went with it. Where else can I talk about things then on my own gawtdamn blog! I knew I would get a ton of different opinions of course. But again I never wanted any sista to feel like shit!
Obviously it has become a big deal and woken up a lot of feelings and opinions and I think it’s a truly interesting debate. Especially because it touches on multiple subjects under the same umbrella.
For all of you that are “Pro-fat” I respect you and I understand what you are trying to do by re-claiming the word and making it positive. Personally I don’t agree with it but that is fine! Do what you gonna do! But try to understand some of us can’t see things your way. And that is OK.
No matter what size you are if you are healthy and happy I am inspired by you. EVERYONE gets discriminated in some way or another. I have naturally skinny friends who have been accused of being drug addicts or anorexic! How the fuck do you think they feel? It sucks for everyone. The world is cruel!
As for movements, I’ll crusade one. It’s called “Bitch Ple Do Your Own Damn Thang movement.” That’s about all of a title you are going to get from me. I don’t say much about my body because I don’t really think about it. I’m not “in denial” about shit! Maybe that’s me being a little of the strong yet silent type?
For people who supported me, thank you and I appreciate you and love you. We will get back to the whimsy shortly.
I have this site to talk about cute clothes, cute boys and above all to make people fucking laugh man. That’s all this girl wants to do. If I somehow inspire you in a positive way, that makes me feel really fucking good. But I don’t ask people to judge my curves. I ain’t in no blogger beauty pageant. I don’t see myself as some style icon when I look in the mirror. I see myself as a fun girl who likes to dress however she wants.
I still stand by my belief that style should not be segregated. I hope someday we don’t have to do any kind of movement to prove that we are all confident and sexy. Maybe that is the unicorn-riding hippie in me, but until then, always be proud of who you are, but be compassionate. We are all strong people with fire in our hearts so it’s hard not to get heated but deep down everyone here wants to just be happy and do good. And keep that in mind always.
Final note: this is the last I will be speaking about this, on here at least. Ya done wore me out people! For now I will keep comments open but please refrain from being rude or calling anybody any names. Here is Herve signing off…
xoxo
Marie
July 23rd, 2009 at 11:29 am
AAAAAAHHHH-HAHAHAHAHAAAAA that Herve video just killed me.
July 23rd, 2009 at 11:44 am
girl… whoa! crazy stuff… just keep doing what you do. i love it!
and totally unrelated: just so you know, the other day had to buy a dress for a party. So i asked myself, “What would marie get?” and i walked out of the store with a $20 hot frock that you wouldn’t believe.
thank for the inspiration!!
:-!
xox,
c.
July 23rd, 2009 at 1:49 pm
“has any one noticed that most of the fashion choices on the other website look like caca dooty you find at a yard sale?”
That’s just bitching and you should be ashamed for putting it on this blog, which is supposed to be a place of love and awesomeness. That’s just really unpleasant.
July 23rd, 2009 at 4:26 pm
Marie, you gotta be what you believe 100% and that means CORN MANICURES FOR EVERYONE!!!
July 23rd, 2009 at 11:46 pm
that hand upon your breast…
July 24th, 2009 at 2:09 pm
@ Anon - LOLOL lighten up, dude.
July 24th, 2009 at 5:12 pm
Just gotta say thanks for taking a stand against being categorized in a way you think is unfavorable. It’s fucked up that people who don’t fit the standard model for attractiveness feel they have to accept being recognized negatively, because it’s somehow better than not being recognized. Wtf?
I think style is style, no matter what body it’s on, and if you have to call your blog post “Fat Love Friday” to make it acceptable for fat people to be on a style blog, there’s something wrong with your philosophy.
On a positive note, your blog is fersure one of my favorites. XD
July 26th, 2009 at 10:08 pm
LOL “unicorn riding hippie”
July 27th, 2009 at 5:22 am
briar posted this:
“I almost commented on that little twit’s blog, but then I realized that she would be getting the credit, not you.
I just want to say that you shined in this situation - it’s not easy to hear things on the Internet and take them in stride, much less stand up for yourself so eloquently.”
So…it’s not okay for Mars to mention you in a blog post that has “fat” in the title (nowhere does she actually call you fat), but it’s perfectly okay for someone to personally attack Mars by calling her a twit?!
Funny that the next thing out of Briar’s mouth was how it’s not easy to hear mean things said about you on the internet. Let’s be fair here — Mars has stood up for herself eloquently.
Though I blog mostly about politics and feminism, I’ve been a big fan of fashion blogs. After seeing the comments here I am taking a bunch of sites off my RSS feed. I don’t think I can enjoy these blogs when I know how catty their owners can become.
July 29th, 2009 at 4:38 pm
So…I don’t want to be a crap slinger…but (lol)
I don’t think the issue is who is being sensitive - but who is being insensitive.
Marie, you are beautiful, and I think it’s a bigger achievement to know that within yourself and not have to look for approval or be told so. Why is there a need for anyone who posts fashion pictures of themselves, who isn’t a size 6, to label themselves as something other than hawt.
Mars, I don’t understand why you need to ‘rename’ the article as anything such as ‘plump’ or ‘plus-sized’.
Why can’t it all be kick-ass style?
Oh and Marie, I just married into a filipino family and totally hear when you’re coming from with filo mums! After years of being ‘fat’you wouldn’t believe the reaction when I’ve recently lost 20kgs - it was almost as though we’d have a child or won the lotto - lol. You gotta love her but
July 29th, 2009 at 5:35 pm
Love, love, love me some Agent Lover! Found this blog when I did a search on “cholos” (perhaps I was looking for a former latin lover??)and saw with my very own eyes, the awesome “cholo” gift basket! I was hooked from there!
Never thought of you as “fat” but have often thought of you as hella “phat”.
Seriously, what that blogger did was so very uncool. Glad you were able to set her straight Agent Lover style!
Much Love from Norte Califas
Angela aka “La Giggles”
::insert random hand signs here::